Hon. Tajudeen Yusuf, lawmaker, who represented Kabba/Bunu Ijumu Federal Constituency, in the Ninth Assembly, in this interview with Sunday Sun warns Peter Obi, the Labour Party presidential candidate in 2023, on pursuing his 2027 presidential agenda with Atiku Abubakar’s support, saying that it would be at his (Obi’s) own peril.
Yusuf also said that the only way for the PDP to return to power is by correcting the “injustice” done in 2015 by returning power to the South.
The former lawmaker also criticised President Bola Tinubu’s first year in office, saying that he performed below average, citing the administration’s policy on fuel subsidy removal as the sole reason, among others. Excerpt:
We have read about all sorts of crises and decampment in the PDP both at the national and state levels. What is really happening in the PDP?
It is the normal trajectory of a political party that is not in power, experiencing conscious effort by its factions to focus on gaining power. An example of this is the All People’s Party (APP) in 1999, which was a significant opposition to the People’s Democratic Party (PDP), but eventually disintegrated. In our current political landscape, there is a tendency for individuals not to remain loyal to their party when it is not in power. This loyalty was evident when the Alliance for Democracy (AD), All Nigeria Peoples Party (ANPP), and Action Congress of Nigeria (ACN) merged to form the All Progressives Congress (APC) and successfully challenged the dominance of the PDP. As history shows, individual parties may struggle to compete with a dominant party like the PDP, but through strategic alliances and mergers, a stronger opposition can emerge. Currently, the PDP, despite being out of power for nearly a decade, remains a formidable force with significant support, including 13 governors. The party is experiencing internal dynamics as members plan for the 2027 elections, with ambitions to create a new political landscape. While uncertainties exist within the APC regarding potential defections, the PDP is seen as the primary challenger to the ruling party due to its established structure and support base. In essence, the PDP’s current position reflects a common phase for political parties outside of power, where internal reorganization, strategic planning, and alliances are crucial for regaining political relevance and challenging the ruling party.
But most Nigerians are disappointed that PDP is not offering strong opposition like it should because of the crisis, the latest being Edo State, your members are decamping en masse from PDP to APC. What is that issue that cannot be resolved?
In the realm of politics, the adage “every politics is local” holds true. The dynamics within the Edo institution are notably distinct. A recent example involves the former Deputy Governor of Edo State who sought the PDP ticket, but was unsuccessful. Feeling marginalised within the PDP, he returned to the APC, his former party. This scenario exemplifies the prevalent trend of defections in Edo. In situations where electoral outcomes and personal ambitions collide, individuals may perceive a lack of fair treatment, prompting them to switch allegiances. While in many regions, individuals typically address grievances within their party, in this particular context, political defections are commonplace. Those of us who resist this norm are sometimes viewed as rigid. However, fostering a robust ideological discourse within political structures is essential for the advancement and consolidation of democracy. Although progress in this regard is still lacking, it is crucial for the growth of democratic principles. While acknowledging the presence of factionalism within the PDP, it is imperative to recognize the need for ideological clarity in political movements. As we mark 25 years of democracy, it is vital to draw inspiration from nations with centuries of democratic tradition and strive to uphold the rule of law as the cornerstone of our political landscape, ensuring fairness and equality for all.
You mentioned that earlier a merger made APC to become a stronger opposition and eventually wrest power from the PDP in 2015. Will you prescribe the same for your party, the PDP?
It is not out of place. It was contemplated in 2019 strongly and I was even a member of that committee that looked at it, but there was now a request for tinkering with the name. And some people were too emotional with the name PDP they didn’t want to tinker with it. In 2023 some people came up with this same idea too, so it will always come up. I believe that if we strike the right chord some will join and what have you. Until ambitions are defined or subjected to basic equity, the unity of purpose of a nation and what have you. If anybody’s ambition becomes larger than the nation’s interest, we will remain where we are. Remember in 1999 PDP came and Obasanjo became the president, he did eight years. Odili ordinarily would have won the primary of PDP in 2007. He was to most I mean, I’m not God, but it seems as if he had canvasses and what have you, he was more acceptable to everybody. But in the wisdom of those men, knowing that after Obasanjo’s eight years power should return to the North, Yar’Adua emerged. Yar’Adua did three years plus and died. Jonathan, his vice president stepped in. He ran for the 2011 election and won by 2013, 2014, there was agitation in the North that it must be there turn. The agitation was led by about five or six governors arrowheaded by Alhaji Atiku Abubakar. I mean, I remember the Eagle Square PDP convention, where they staged a walkout, that they felt it’s the turn of the North. That Obasanjo having done eight years, and Yar’Adua having done only three years, it was their turn. That is why we need to put these things into perspective that our politics as are today, you cannot divorce religion, ethnicity and those things away from it. And understanding this decide to zone not to geopolitical zone … when people make those assertions, manipulating the facts, I laugh. PDP zone presidential ticket to North and South. We have six geopolitical zones in Nigeria. It is the responsibility of the South to decide whoever emerges from there. PDP national chairman was zoned to the Northern zone not North-central. And Ayu emerged. Senator Ningi was contesting from Bauchi. Shema was contesting from Katsina. North-central was able to streamline to Ayu alone, while other zones had more people and that was how Ayu emerged. So, that’s how the consensus was built. But nobody zoned to the North-central, it was zoned to the North. So, presidential candidacy is always zoned to either North or South. And the North in 2014 felt it must be their turn and some people left PDP and went to APC. That’s why PDP became an opposition party. Even when Alhaji Atiku Abubakar did not get his ambition fulfilled by becoming APC candidate, he stuck with APC for Buhari to emerge because he was convinced it was the turn of the North. In 2019, PDP realising that, hey, is now in the North, no Southerner contested Port Harcourt primaries because it was zoned to the North and Atiku emerged. I believe he won that election. But the legality is that Buhari was declared. I might be wrong, but I believe Atiku won the election in 2023. The North has had eight years with Buhari and so PDP in his wisdom, zoned chairmanship to the North so that the presidential candidate will come from the South. People who wanted to contest vehemently opposed that zoning of chairmanship position. I remember the NEC meeting. I’ve never seen Alhaji Atiku Abubakar so angry that he opposed it because of his ambition. The NEC meeting is done in two phases. The first meeting is open, where addresses are made and what have you. The next is behind closed doors after the press had gone. But Unfortunately, he was so angry that he forgot we were still on the first phase of the meeting and went into the main issue of zoning. But people pushed that it was zoned to the North. And then it came to the presidency…because when I hear him say, if it’s zoned to the Southeast… I heard him say several times that if the presidency is zoned to the Southeast he would not have contested. No. It’s a misrepresentation of truth and fact. The presidency was supposed to be zoned to the South, but Atiku mobilised his structure to make sure it was not zoned to the South. For the first time, PDP could not zone the presidency. I was also a member of that committee, former Benue governor, Samuel Ortom chaired that committee. I followed every activity, each state produced somebody on that platform and Alhaji Atiku Abubkar mobilised every of his supporter, who were on that platform to make sure it was not zoned to the South. So, when it became obvious that it could not be zoned, the party left it open, that’s why he could contest. So, for him to now say if it was zoned to the Southeast…. Zoning is not cast in stone. There are processes of zoning and there are meetings. So, when he truncated that process, he made sure it never happened. Now, he is coming out today and saying if it’s zoned to the Southeast, he would not have contested. So that those who do not have information, who are not privy to the workings of the party will assume and follow gullibly such assertion. It’s not right. The PDP should have zoned the presidency to the South in 2023. Some people argue that Buhari was of the APC and ruled for eight years and PDP is a different party and must not toe the same line on the zoning, but the question is, which country did he govern? Is it not Nigeria? So, the argument is that after APC through a northern candidate has ruled for eight years, should the PDP zone the presidency to the North again? But we are not yet there and we should get to where you come from, your religion should not be determinant of who emerges as president of Nigeria. But we will build trust, confidence where those things become the order of the day, the colour of your skin, the choice of your world, the choice of your association does not determine who or what you will become. But your competence, your capacity should determine that, but we are not there yet of a truth, let’s not deceive ourselves. Even APC after the tenure of Buhari zoned to the South. So, the truth of the matter is that, PDP goofed in not zoning to the South. Because certain cleavages were very strong and entrenched made sure it never happened. I don’t like when such cleavages and interest are now coming out to say, I would not have contested if it is zoned to the Southeast. We didn’t zone to the Southeast. We zone to Southwest, or Southeast, we zone to South.
Are you saying he’s dishonest in his assertion this time and are you saying Peter Obi should not take him seriously?
If he takes him seriously, it is at his own peril. I might be wrong, but Obi knows why he left PDP, forget about all what people are saying. I’m aware of what happened after 2019. And don’t forget that in the same breath, Atiku said PDP will determine. So PDP will determine on Obi who is no longer in PDP? No, let’s be sincere with ourselves. See, it is a mind game. 2027 is coming and so this is marketing strategy. So, gullible people listening to him will say, aha! This man would have buried his ambition if this had happened. I don’t believe it is coming from him, but I believe his strategists are the ones coming up with those things for him to say. See, the last NEC meeting of the PDP, people thought it was about the national chairman, it’s a lie from the pit of hell. It is about 2027. There are going to be congresses in about 20 states and all of a sudden people are just saying the chairman must go, the chairman must stay. Ayu had been there for this long and the house did not sit down and say this is a replacement of Ayu and it was stopped. Because a NEC meeting was called and certain interests felt that if this NEC meeting was held and congresses are conducted without my man as chairman, it might affect my ambition. And then all of a sudden, there was agitation that the national chairman must go. Hey, the chairmanship position was not even on the agenda. But every media house and everywhere, it was about the removal of the national chairman, as if the meeting was about the national chairman. So, what they wanted to do was to coerce the party into taking such a decision. So, as to install somebody that will allow him to make reasonable roads for their 2027 ambition.
President Tinubu will be one year in office on May 29. Nigerians have reacted to all sorts of policies he has churned out. And already the talk about 2027 has begun, can PDP with all its internal crisis give APC a run for its money?
What PDP should do is simple. Go back to the foundation of the principle and policy of the party and zone presidency to the South now. There must be a sense of equity, members must feel that you are a part of a system that recognizes that you deserve to be respected. Tinubu is just privileged, he is fortunate to have won. I have conviction that if we had done it right, Tinubu wouldn’t have emerged, PDP would have won the last election. But we bungled it. So, the only thing we must do is to go back to where you missed it, you can’t be pretending that something is not wrong and you assume things will be right. See, people can bottle up and keep quiet, but that does not mean they are happy with what is going on. You can’t satisfy everybody, but let it be seen that equity is displayed. Buhari has done eight years, the presidency should have gone to the South, if they had done that, it would have reduced all these skirmishes in the party. Whoever is contesting the 2027 election should come from the South and let’s see what will happen. But if we do not do that, we are still hiding behind one finger, pretending if they zone to the Southeast, I will not contest, we are only deceiving ourselves. The mark of a good leader, the mark of a respected patriot is that even when it does not fit or suit your desire, but because the right thing is to be done, you allow it to be. So men and women should rise to the responsibilities of showing character in the PDP. Everyone must realise that this party, some people are gone, some still will go, but it will outlive all of us. The only thing that Nigerians will value us and respect us for, is when we bequeath to them a viral party that can challenge the APC. Because the moment a ruling party does not have a strong party that can challenge them, we have left the people with no choice and it will be so disastrous. That’s what happened in the last election and if we don’t take time it will happen again. Obi will come from here, others will come from there and they will take a chunk, it will be too easy and APC will walk away with victory. It is not rocket science. I tell people to go and study the 2011 Jonathan election. Jonathan was of PDP, to tell you how ethnicity and religion determines our result in the election. But Jonathan’s vote to win 2011, 81 per cent came from South-south, Southeast and Middle Belt. Let me give you Northeast states that produce PDP governors, but voted against PDP in presidential elections. In fact, PDP did not have 10 per cent in Kano and Bauchi and we had PDP governors. We had PDP governor in Sokoto, we had PDP Senators and House of Representatives and yet, PDP did not have upto 25 per cent of the votes cast. Also go and study the 2015 election, 79 per cent came from that block for Jonathan. So, our election is still being determined by those things. People should divorce emotion and go get this data, look at it you will know the pattern of our election.
You said Obi should trust Atiku at his own peril, what do you mean by that?
Well, Obi is a politician and he has ambition. He is meeting a seasoned politician who is saying that if it is going to Southeast he will not contest and you’ll go to the bank with that? Like I said, PDP doesn’t zone to the Southeast, but to the South. And in the same breath Atiku said, PDP will determine… will PDP determine for someone who’s not in PDP? No. So, that’s why I’m saying he can choose to take to the bank all that Atiku has said, it’s his prerogative.
You are sounding as if Atiku is out to destabilise the party if things don’t go his way and he has said he is not retiring from politics any time soon?
I don’t subscribe to those who say he should retire. He has a lot of experience that we can still tap from, but must he be the candidate? What we are lacking majorly in PDP presently is that we do not have that person whose interest is to build harmony and unity and he can fit into that. If Atiku drops his ambition today, he becomes a rallying point. Unfortunately, Obasanjo that was doing that has left active politics, Jonathan did not step in. PDP is not a party that can be owned by one individual. No, but let’s have somebody that people can defer to. When there is an issue we need somebody who understands it’s not about his interest, but about the interest of everyone. That’s what we’re lacking. So, I don’t subscribe to him retiring, I subscribe to him playing that role to make sure that PDP gets it right. When people expressed surprise with my position, I said I cannot deny the fact that I benefited from the PDP. I’ve run the election four times in the PDP, I won three. If I didn’t have that platform, maybe I would not be here. Alhaji Atiku Abubakar cannot deny the fact that the PDP has been too good to him. He won the governorship election before swearing in, he became vice president for eight years. We cannot write the history of Nigeria without remembering him. But it is not in my place to tell a man not to pursue his ambition. I remember in 2012 I granted an interview to the late Andrew Jaiyeola of Thisday. My response to his question was, Jonathan should sacrifice his 2015 ambition for the unity and peace of Nigeria. And people came for me, saying how could you? I saw it at that time. I supported Jonathan, but I felt that with him emerging in 2011, there was a lot of agitation in the North and the insurgency that was coming up, I believe that it was motivated by that assumption that power has been captured from us. I said he was eminently qualified to run for a second term, but for the peace and unity of Nigeria he should sacrifice it. I remember June 12th or 13th when that publication came out, people were reporting me everywhere. What’s your business? What do you want to prove with this? But if you look back now, don’t you think it would have been noble if that was done. If power was zoned to the North by PDP in 2015, we would have been in power by now. So, I’m saying the same thing that Alhaji Atiku Abubakar should sacrifice his ambition for the PDP to come back to power. It might not look popular, but I remember very well when I granted that interview in 2012 it was not popular and it’s still not popular today.
Again Tinubu’s one year in office, how would you rate his administration against the backdrop of his policies so far?
I will rate him below average for one major reason. I think there’s this virtue that every leader deserves to have, courage. But in showing courage you must have empathy and you must be strategic. In an attempt to show courage on subsidy, I think it was wrongly timed and was not well processed. I think that he would have given six months to one year before announcing when the subsidy will stop and then roll out certain policies deliberately. Like I said in 2012 when I moved the motion against the removal of subsidy under Jonathan, in the House of Representatives, and in that motion, I said I’m not opposed to subsidy removal. I’m an economist, but that the manner it was done. I said there’s no nation that does not have one subsidy or the other. But subsidizing fuel is a wrong strategy for us. Let’s transfer the subsidy to education, agriculture. Let it be that a child that is born today, his or her parents does not have any fear of how he’s going to go to school. That way, the government is taking the burden off the family when subsidy is taken off. When food is produced in excess, the government buys and let it go at subsidized rate so that the lowest cadre level of the society can eat. That was my position in 2012 and is still my position now. So, I feel the government was tactless or not too strategic in that approach of removing subsidy. If you observed that is why lot of things came crumbling down, because the system was not ready for it. That’s my major reason for rating them below average. Because it has a ripple effect. There’s what is called the bandwagon effect in economics. One determines what happened to the next. My mother is a market woman. She does not know anything about interest rate, but she knows that when the price of transportation increases the price of her goods must increase. The thing just went boom and we just realised that somebody who feeds his family with N30,000 for a month now feeds his family with that amount in one week. So, this government after the effect of that pronouncement now started thinking of how to help the person. They should have thought of how the consequences of this action will affect the people and plan ahead. It is now we’re launching buses, it is now we are doing food palliative. It should have been with available for the people. The same should have happened in the transportation sector, with the buses already in place and routes mapped out to take the pressure off the people. I still insist fuel subsidy does not benefit the poor, but the rich. Remove subsidy and put it in things that will benefit the people.
Credit: Sun Newspaper